The Reckoning Interview: Devin Barrington-Ward
Last summer, Atlanta, like many cities, faced the incredible reckoning around racial justice that spread across the country. Last June, I had the opportunity to sit down with Devin Barrington-Ward, an Atlanta advocate, and leader whom I admire deeply, to discuss his organizing work in the midst of it all. He agreed to chat. An excerpt from our discussion is below.
Charles: The reason I reached out to you is because we’re starting a new online publication that focuses on Atlanta. You’re one of the first people I thought about talking to because I know you’re at the forefront of the social justice movement here, so I wanted to profile you and talk to you about the work that you’re up to.
Devin: Wow, thank you.
Charles: How would you describe what’s happening right now in Atlanta and from a Black movement perspective?
Devin: This is our time. This is our moment. We are at a very critical juncture as a country and as Black people, we’ve always been at a critical juncture, but at this moment I believe that things are shifting. I’m reminded of what Malcolm X said after Kennedy’s assassination: “the chickens are coming home to roost” and that’s exactly what is happening right now. Those chickens are coming home to roost in the form of people in the streets demanding immediate reform and not lip service, not another blue-ribbon commission, not another task force. Reforms. We know what people need right now at this moment. The movement has always known what we need for our people; we haven’t been listened to. Now, I think people are finally at a place of complete frustration around the lack of listening. If the officials who can make these decisions won’t listen, the people will occupy the streets until they listen.
Charles: So what’s next? What’s happening now and what’s to come?
Devin: There are multiple protests that are scheduled all through this week and into the weekend. Also, there’s an election, so there’s a lot of energy around both things because people see the value in both things - occupying the voting booth and taking to the streets. We know that with these laws that allow for police to brutalize Black people with no recourse, no accountability, somebody is responsible for voting for it or not voting for it. I believe that people understand that the protest will have to lead to a lot of energy around this [local] election because a lot of the state and local offices are the ones that are important to reforming this dangerous culture of the police in our communities.
Charles: Also, you also co-led a protest at the Governor’s mansion. What was that like for you?
Devin: Yes, I co-led a protest at the Governor’s mansion and it was inspiring, but also disappointing. What was inspiring was seeing that the crowd was multi-racial, actually probably more white folks out there than Black folks, and it was an opportunity as organizers to also do a teach-in for white folks as far as how they want to be a part of these movements. We made it very clear that when the police and state troopers and national guard mobilized against protesters, the white folks needed to be willing to put their body on the line, to stand as a human shield for Black people and the people of color that are out there with them. We know that putting white people on the front line does de-escalate things. The police are oftentimes more hesitant to use force if they see that the crowd is made up of majority-white protestors, that the protestors are on the front line are white. We told the white folks that were out there with us that this is your opportunity to right the wrongs of their ancestors. We are out there as Black people honoring our ancestors and fighting to fulfill the wildest imaginations that they’ve had for us, but they [the white protestors] also have ancestors. And some of those ancestors were very complicit in our oppression. We appreciate that you [the white protestors] are out here with us today and this is your opportunity to right the wrongs of the past and to deal with the sins of your ancestors. And folks did that. That was very inspiring.
It was also inspiring to see our Muslim brothers and sisters close out the protest with prayer which was so powerful, the imagery of that. We know that Black folks are not monolithic, many of us are Christian, but many of us identify as Muslim. They are also a part of the community that is oppressed by government and law enforcement and targeted by police violence because of the fear of terrorism. We know that terrorism in this country has always been propagated by white supremacy. So, that was powerful imagery.
I was disappointed by seeing how we opted to end our protest because we found out about the curfew in the middle of the protest and we had one of the co-leaders of the protest who was communicating with the law enforcement on-site and they were very clear that they were going to use tear gas against us even though we had not escalated at all in our tactics. No one had thrown anything at the police. As a matter of fact, the first shot that was fired came from state troopers. It was disappointing to see how the government was using our money to mobilize against us. They were using our money to use tanks, National Guard troops, tear gas, batons, and police equipment against peaceful people who were out there with their signs, with their voices, with their righteous outrage.
Charles: Were you afraid?
Devin: I wasn’t. I was not afraid. And the reason why I wasn’t afraid is because I come from a family of freedom fighters. My Mother’s side of the family is Jamaican and my great-grandmother is Cassandra Bogle which gives me a connection to the Bogle family. Paul Bogle is one of Jamaica’s national heroes. He led a rebellion in1865 against the British government that was really a pivotal moment in Jamaican history that allowed for more self-determination and more Black political identity in Jamaica. Having him as my (4x)great-grandfather, he is one of the ancestors that I pray to often, that I reflect on often. When I was on the megaphone, everything that I said I believed which is “no fear, no fear.” These are our streets. We are a peaceful people. We are not violent, they are. I had no fear because I knew that I was fighting on the side of righteousness.
Charles: What are some of the demands that folks were making specifically?
Devin: Some of those demands are: reinstatement of the citizen’s review board and ensuring that we are banning dangerous arrest practices, like the chokehold used on Eric Garner or the knee in someone’s spine like George Floyd. Also, banning no-knock warrants. We have to uplift Breonna Taylor, a Black woman, an EMT, a frontline worker who was killed in her sleep because Louisville police, in Kentucky, used a no-knock warrant on the wrong address.
Charles: And these things are legal in Atlanta?
Devin: Some of these things are legal in Atlanta. I know the Atlanta police department has not used no-knock warrants at the same level since the Katherine Johnson shooting in 2006, but other agencies across the state are still allowed to use no-knock warrants and we know that metro-Atlanta is much bigger than the city of Atlanta.
Also, the continued divestment from police and from prisons and jails. We actually had a really successful action yesterday in Fulton County. Believe it or not, there were about 23 million dollars in COVID-relief funds to build more beds in Fulton County Jail. They were about to use 23 million dollars that was supposed to provide relief to communities impacted by COVID-19 to do an expansion at Fulton County jail. We came there with the same energy that people had around George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, Jimmy Atchison, Deondra Phillips, and all the other names that have been snuffed out by police violence. We know that police violence isn’t just killing folks. It's having folks in jail, in prison that don’t need to be there. We were able to do direct action organizing and make very clear demands to the folks at Fulton County Commission that we would hold them accountable if they voted to approve the 23 million dollar expansion proposal. Yesterday, 30 minutes after we ended the protest, we got the news that the Commissioners voted 6-1 to refuse the contract and to ensure that it would never come back up again in the conversation of COVID-relief funds. That’s a win.
Charles: Absolutely, congratulations.
Devin: For all the folks that say protesting is just people in the streets yelling, it's not. Protest plus public policy can equal progress for people, but you have to go into the streets with clear intention.
Charles: That’s amazing, Devin. Are there any final things that you would like to share before we wrap?
Devin: I want to uplift organizations like my own, the Black Futures Group, Solutions Not Punishments Collaborative, Racial Justice Action Center, Women on the Rise. These are the people that are leading these prison abolitionist efforts to hold bad cops accountable in the city of Atlanta with results. For folks that want to get involved and get connected, it's important to have an organizing home, so those are places to support and to consider and call home for the direct action organizing tactics.
Charles: Beautiful. Thank you so much, Devin. I appreciate your time.
Devin: Thank you. Be safe out here.
